But not being a Christian I'm not big on guilt for a start. I think this is a sick poster asking men to sacrifice their lives to a stupid bloody war by force of peer-pressure.
Conscription is exercising the right of slavery in the defense of the state. That premise reduces your choices and actions, your life, to necessarily expendible at the disposal of the social collective. But it's supposed to belong to someone else.
"conscription is exercising the right of slavery..."
What do you mean? I don't care about your social collective - if the country is under threat of invasion, then the sensible and patriotic response is to take up arms. Conscription does have its place.
I mean conscription is slavery. It couldn't be more plain.
This war poster isn't about conscription though of course, which was not employed by our side in that war.
All very well for you to say that your slaves will be responding with sense and patriotism. But then why do you enslave them to do it? Can't people be patriotic and sensible without your lash? And if you lash them into motive actions against their will can their actions very well be called sensible and patriotic?
"What do you mean? I don't care about your social collective - if the country is under threat of invasion, then the sensible and patriotic response is to take up arms. Conscription does have its place."
What if I wish to welcome my new alien overlords with open arms.. does conscription have a place then?
Would it be justified for ... lets say the iraqi's to use conscription due to threat of US invasion a few years ago?
What if individual iraqis supported the invasion, but the government didnt?
Of course the last time New Zealand was under plausible threat of invasion was WW2. Your life does not belong to the state, but if you believe you are threatened by invasion then yes, feel free to fight it - but no one should be forced to. Indeed the relevant (male) members of my family didn't, but one was an engineer in shipyards, the other had 3 jobs.
Well, as citizens of New Zealand, don't we have a duty to fight for her freedom?
At some point, the government forcing people to fight may be our last hope of survival...
And MikeE, if you wish to welcome your new alien overlords with open arms - well sorry, chances are the majority of your countrymen don't agree with you - though I definitely see what you're saying, and it's a good point.
Anyway, like I said before, this poster isn't forcing anyone to fight, and it's not necessarily trying to make guys feel guilty - but it does leave them to ask themselves the question - which is a good thing.
Is this blog trying to guilt-trip me into volunteiring for World War One?
ReplyDeleteYes!
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think Rick? I just reckon the poster is really great even today, it gets you thinking.
Good times.
Not wishing to be a downer.
ReplyDeleteBut not being a Christian I'm not big on guilt for a start. I think this is a sick poster asking men to sacrifice their lives to a stupid bloody war by force of peer-pressure.
Sick times.
Who says this poster is about guilt?
ReplyDeleteIt's simply letting men ask themselves the question.
The idea of conscription, etc grates with me - but at times I think it is necessary.
Brave times.
Conscription is exercising the right of slavery in the defense of the state. That premise reduces your choices and actions, your life, to necessarily expendible at the disposal of the social collective. But it's supposed to belong to someone else.
ReplyDeleteWe both agree it's guilt-tripping propaganda.
says you...
ReplyDelete;)
Says reason. And, Silent Running.
ReplyDeleteThe link didn't work...
ReplyDelete"conscription is exercising the right of slavery..."
What do you mean? I don't care about your social collective - if the country is under threat of invasion, then the sensible and patriotic response is to take up arms. Conscription does have its place.
Works now.
ReplyDeleteI mean conscription is slavery. It couldn't be more plain.
This war poster isn't about conscription though of course, which was not employed by our side in that war.
All very well for you to say that your slaves will be responding with sense and patriotism. But then why do you enslave them to do it? Can't people be patriotic and sensible without your lash? And if you lash them into motive actions against their will can their actions very well be called sensible and patriotic?
Conscription has its place: in the sick past.
"What do you mean? I don't care about your social collective - if the country is under threat of invasion, then the sensible and patriotic response is to take up arms. Conscription does have its place."
ReplyDeleteWhat if I wish to welcome my new alien overlords with open arms.. does conscription have a place then?
Would it be justified for ... lets say the iraqi's to use conscription due to threat of US invasion a few years ago?
What if individual iraqis supported the invasion, but the government didnt?
Is conscription ok then?
What did YOU do in the war?
Of course the last time New Zealand was under plausible threat of invasion was WW2. Your life does not belong to the state, but if you believe you are threatened by invasion then yes, feel free to fight it - but no one should be forced to. Indeed the relevant (male) members of my family didn't, but one was an engineer in shipyards, the other had 3 jobs.
ReplyDeleteWell, as citizens of New Zealand, don't we have a duty to fight for her freedom?
ReplyDeleteAt some point, the government forcing people to fight may be our last hope of survival...
And MikeE, if you wish to welcome your new alien overlords with open arms - well sorry, chances are the majority of your countrymen don't agree with you - though I definitely see what you're saying, and it's a good point.
Anyway, like I said before, this poster isn't forcing anyone to fight, and it's not necessarily trying to make guys feel guilty - but it does leave them to ask themselves the question - which is a good thing.
Aren't I glad the world wasn't full of weird liberals like you rick, libertyscott and mikee in the early 20th century.
ReplyDeleteIf it was then we would have been overrun by nazi's killing off whoever they choose.
Why should they have the choice to choose who they kill?